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Question For Sheldon - About Two Other Burt Lancaster Films
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Sheldon

May I ask if you have seen the following Burt Lancaster films, which I like very much -

Valdez Is Coming

Ulzana's Raid

I've seen them several times on television, but I hope to get the dvds soon, so I don't know if the quality, etc., has been improved for them.

What do you think of these films ?

Thanks

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Sheldon Hall


Joined: 01 Sep 2005
Posts: 377
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Hi Coll,

I've seen both and, while I quite like VALDEZ (the favourite Western of a Welsh friend of mine!), I particularly admire ULZANA'S RAID, one of the great Westerns of the 70s. It's often interpreted as a disguised comment on America's involvement in the Vietnam War, but it works just as well as a 'revisionist' version of the traditional Cavalry Western.

Incidentally, if you've not yet committed yourself to a purchase, I'd strongly recomend buying a non-UK version of the ULZANA DVD, as the Region 2 UK release contains 17 seconds of BBFC cuts to four scenes for violence or horse falls. See the website [email protected] for details. Also, there are two variant versions of the film (leaving aside censorship interference): one authorised by the director, Robert Aldrich, the other by Lancaster himself. One of these is the version available on DVD; the other has been screened several times by the BBC (with different censor cuts!). Sources differ on which version is which.
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leightarrant


Joined: 21 Feb 2006
Posts: 131
Location: East Sussex
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May I just add, THE PROFESSIONALS and THE TRAIN to this narrative...

Great films....Maurice Jarre did the scores to both films I do believe.
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Sheldon Hall


Joined: 01 Sep 2005
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Leigh, you're right on both counts! Again, the Region 1 DVDs of both versions are preferable to the UK editions (for more special features, inc. a director's audio commentary on THE TRAIN).
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Sheldon

Thank you for answering my question.

Yes. I agree. 'Ulzana's Raid' is a fine western, which I do recall reading that comparisons were made with events in Vietnam. I don't know if it was in one of the massive film guides you can get, that I read of such. I no longer have a copy, but most only gave a summary of the films, due the large extent of movies covered.

I may be wrong, but there is something in the 3 characters Burt Lancaster portrays in these films, that I feel are somehow connected, in both these films, plus 'Zulu Dawn'. Could it be that they all seem to know their enemy better than most ?

I find it interesting, but not I guess important, that his character Durnford, fought from the top of a wagon, yet in 'Ulzana's Raid' his character was positioned underneath. I know it's a pointless point. Wink

I've read reviews about 'Ulzana's Raid' and some people are annoyed at the cuts, as the film, it is considered, is all about horses, and denying the indians of their acquiring such. To cut any of these scenes involving the horses, it is felt, takes away the point of how the cavalrymen were to catch Ulzana and his men. Someone even made the point of saying that they'll ban all the smoking scenes in films before long !

Thanks again

Coll

PS. I've seen the film posters for both films, the 'Valdez Is Coming' one, is great.
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Additionally, I saw another film starring Burt Lancaster, only once on television, but I remembered it being quite unusual -

Castle Keep

I've seen it is available on dvd also, so I'll add it to my other choices mentioned above.

What did you make of this film Sheldon ?

Is it anti-war, pro-war, or something else ?

Perhaps, it asks the question, if I remember correctly, do works of art have more worth than men's lives ?

I'd be very interested in your opinion.

Thank you

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leightarrant


Joined: 21 Feb 2006
Posts: 131
Location: East Sussex
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As we're talking Burt Lancaster, how about a melodrama for you from the big top.........TRAPEZE......although I prefer 'THE GREATEST SHOW ON EARTH' - also, I kinda like 'THE KENTUCKIAN' but it is very dated now.


Coll - Have you ever seen any of the 'Mutiny on the Bounty' films? like to know what you think of these? Brando version is underrated. I like the BOUNTY with Mel Gibson, thought it was quite a moving film. I'd like to see a newer film where it goes into the Pitcairn Island story more. All the films cut off once we've reach this piece of real history. I find this piece of history as facinating as I do the Zulu wars.

Back to Lancaster, best avoided is the 1986 film 'TOUGH GUYS'
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Sheldon Hall


Joined: 01 Sep 2005
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CASTLE KEEP is an interesting, if very odd, movie. I saw it in a pristine 70mm print in Oslo, Norway. Anti-war, I guess, but it's rather surreal and dreamlike. As for whether art is more valuable than human life - I don't think I'd commit myself to such an opinion, but art certainly lasts longer!
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Leigh

Yes. I've seen both.

Brando's ? Very good visually. Apparently, Brando befriended an extra from whom he could learn the way of talking he used in the film, but afterwards ignored him. Might, or might not be true. I know not.

Gibson's ? Haunting music if I remember correctly. Fine performance by Hopkins.

As for Tough Guys. Lancaster and Douglas were the best of friends for years. I'm figuring they just wanted to make a film together that would be a bit of a laugh for them as well as audiences.

I'm sure I recall seeing them doing a song-and-dance act together at one of the awards ceremonies, about them not caring that they didn't win anything. It was a while ago, so the facts may differ.

Paul Newman happened to mention recently, that he and Robert Redford would like to make a film together again. Whether serious or a comedy, I don't know ? I think they're waiting for the right script.

Sheldon

Anti-war. Yes. Should the castle have been used as a defensive position, due to its history and its contents, or somewhere else be chosen, in order to protect the art, etc.? The owner of it would have liked it so.

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You know I was looking at all the films Mr. Lancaster did... alot!... and just have to say that he was some movie actor moving in and out of roles with such different characters...Sorry Wrong Number...Flame and the arrow..Seven days in May...Come back Little Sheba and and last but not least Zulu Dawn.

But I have to say I was a bit surprised when I did see ZD for the first time
to see Lancaster in the role as Durnford. I said what's an Amercian doing here in a "South African" film. But Mr. Endfield didn't care if his Durnford was American or not. He fit the part according to him. (I think Burt practiced an accent for the film) And to my mind, I've never heard Lancaster speaking about the part but did he ever?
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Rich

My friend (may I call you that ?)

I've heard one comment, apparently from Burt Lancaster, about his role as Durnford, stating that he was glad the British got beaten.

I'm saddened if it is true. Sad

Sheldon - Tell me it ain't so ?

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Sheldon

With the greatest respect for you, as you know.

However, on the subject of art and men's lives, and the mention by yourself that art lasts longer - I disagree.

There are many men, through history, possibly as long as art, are very much known in memory, rather than physical presence, as art is.

People, like myself, to quote Oliver Reed's character in 'Gladiator', are just - " ...shadows and dust... " in the wider context of history. But some, live forever.

I'd like to think I'd be known by future generations, as one of the individuals who tried to defend the good Col. Durnford many years after his death.

This is highly unlikely. So, talking about myself, I am lost to history.

I hope you understand my point.

Regards

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Sheldon Hall


Joined: 01 Sep 2005
Posts: 377
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Rich,
Cy Endfield had nothing to do with Burt's being cast in "Zulu Dawn" - he co-wrote the script but was not involved with the production. Cy dropped out when Stanley Baker (for whom Durnford was originally intended) was diagnosed with cancer, and the project was subsequently taken up by other hands. One of the things Cy disliked about ZD was the casting of too many familar faces, so work out what he thought of Burt! BL, incidentally, was Columbia's casting choice for Chard when Cy was approaching distributors for finance in the early 60s...

Coll,
I've got an interview with Burt on the set of ZD, so I'll revisit it to see what he says about the battle. But please don't misunderstand me in the art vs. humanity debate (if that's what it is): perhaps I sounded rather too glib and facetious. I certainly didn't mean that art outlasts the memory or influence of individuals, as history has obviously proven otherwise. I simply meant that physical objets d'art survive longer than actual human lives: people rarely outlast a century (in purely physical terms!) but we have artworks which have survived millennia, and through which we are better able to understand the lives of our ancestors.
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Rich
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Sheldon..
Thanks for that clarification on Mr. Lancaster with Endfield. I'd think that if anybody(especially Americans) thought of his films ZD would not be top of mind. And just wondering how much of the real Durnford got translated to the screen because of his performance. Er..we saw what happened to the portrayal of Hook!

In any case, I have to hand it to him that he tried to stretch himself with some different foreign/international roles. I've noticed that "The Leopard" came out a while back where he plays a Sicilian prince back in 1860 lamenting how his aristocratic world was being changed by Republicanism. Thought I'd check it out soon. And it would be great to see comments made by Lancaster on the ZD film.
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Managed to get 'Ulzana's Raid'. Very Happy

I'm sure it'll be as good as I remember.

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Question For Sheldon - About Two Other Burt Lancaster Films
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