rorkesdriftvc.com Forum Index


rorkesdriftvc.com
Discussions related to the Anglo-Zulu War of 1879
Reply to topic
AMB


Joined: 07 Oct 2005
Posts: 921
Reply with quote
Martin,

Many thanks for the 'heads up'. Will the RRW Museum be stocking the title?

Regards,

AMB
View user's profileSend private message
diagralex


Joined: 31 Aug 2005
Posts: 208
Location: Broomfield, Essex
Reply with quote
Peter

How true your comments are. British history is a subject which the current trend is to just forget about.
A prime example is the daughter of our neighbour. She began to teach in primary school last year and somehow the subject of history teaching was mentioned.
Amongst the subjects mentioned was Admiral Nelson - Blank looks - who was he ? I thought that she was joking, but it turned out that she had never heard his name mentioned in her history lessons.
I asked her if she had heard of Wellington. Again blank looks and the answer NO !
It is unbelievable that the two most important British military men of the 19th century were a subject of mistification to her.
If the current curriculum can afford to skip over our historical giants, then what chance does poor old Durnford have ?

Graham
View user's profileSend private message
youth of today
Robert John


Joined: 31 Aug 2005
Posts: 205
Location: The Netherlands
Reply with quote
Diagralex,

You are absolutely right.
Not so long ago I was reading a book about Wilson Winereh,s [ I hope I,ve spelt his surname correctly, Dawn!] all conquering All Blacks of the 1960,s.
I asked my son if he knew who he was and he said " Oh yes, he was a President of the U.S.A." Suitably impressed I thought I,d give it another go and asked "Have you ever heard of, probably the greatest foofballer of all time, George Best" and sat back to wait for the correct answer.
"Of course I have" he said sarcastically "he was one of The Beatles"
I couldn,t even be bothered to explain to him!!

Robert

_________________
R J Jones
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mail
Rich
Guest

Reply with quote
Well after reading all the foregoing I have to kind of fess up in the sense that really things aren't looking up with history in my country either. I, too, have tried to tell my sons to pay attention to the past. heh heh I liked that on George Best. A good one. But on a serious level, a comment by my high school soon made my jaw drop. It seems they were having a conversation on World War II and this group called the 'Nazis' and another one called the "Axis" in "social studies" class (they don't term it "historyc" class). My son cringed when a student asked "Nazis? Who are they?" As for the "Axis", forget about that one. Great learning experience for him. He knew then that some use their heads only as a hat rack.... Wink
tony.ashford.@ntlworld,co


Joined: 02 Sep 2005
Posts: 41
Location: Lenton, Nottingham
Reply with quote
Hi all,

I'm a retired teacher, of primary children, and I taught history, mostly Tudor and Victorian, though often I included history in other topics (eg, a topic on National Days included Nelson.) I did in fact mention the sainted Durnford in my topic on Victorian wars- am I the only one who has?? Of course, as one who has always had a deep interest in all peroids of history, I always tried to give as full and rounded a picture as possible, but I have to say that in my experience history now is not looked on as of major importance in schools and it is true that many are not taught what we older generation might consider the essentials in our history which should include all political, military and social events of significance, as well as major individuals who contributed. I do agree also that few children are not now aware of the chronology of our history as topics are not necessarily taught in chronological order. There is also the modern spectre of political correctness to be taken into account - but that's another question!
View user's profileSend private message
Rich
Guest

Reply with quote
I don't know Tony. I think this is a serious problem. Maybe it has something to do about jobs, work, money but studying about history appears to be going the way of the dodo. Is that good? I don't think so. We'll pay for it somewhere down the line.
diagralex


Joined: 31 Aug 2005
Posts: 208
Location: Broomfield, Essex
Reply with quote
What is that old adage ?

You must remember your past to stop you making the same mistakes in the future.

Let us hope that our history does not become thought of as irrelevant.

Graham
View user's profileSend private message
Rich
Guest

Reply with quote
Graham..just a little bit on the "subjects of mystification" for that primary teacher..

Way back when I went to college, when coonskin caps and gunpowder was in vogue, I noticed that the professors who taught me the INTRODUCTORY courses of the curriculum I was taking had so many honors, publications and awards attached to them. They weren't good but very very good and had the esteem and total respect of their peers. They were the best. I always wondered about that and mentioned to another professor why are they teaching that course to me. I mean should they be really teaching "on that level". Don't they prefer a bigger stage? The professor kind of just looked at me and said we'd all be in trouble if medical schools all thought that way... Wink .
Dawn


Joined: 31 Aug 2005
Posts: 610
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
Reply with quote
However, what is encouraging is that historical fiction for children is trendy at the moment, the next big thing after wizards, apparently. Scholastic in particular have a "My Story" series that appears to be popular with the kids. Subjects so far have included Agincourt, Crimea, Trafalgar and Zulu War, amongst others. This, it seems, is a way to generate interest and educate at the same time. So all is not lost...yet!

Dawn
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mailVisit poster's website
Peter Ewart


Joined: 31 Aug 2005
Posts: 1797
Location: Near Canterbury, Kent, England.
Reply with quote
Crikey - my little (or not so little) cri de coeur appears to have struck a chord. It is reassuring that there are others who worry about the state of our history curriculum, especially the place of British history in the whole picture. In the space of a couple of generations, it seems to me that we have suddenly lost a 2,000 old history which has somehow gone missing.

There may be a mixture of reasons but underlying everything is the feeling that if the powers-that-be had their way, no British history at all would be taught. I believe it is because we live in "anti-imperialist" times (a good thing for this day and age, obviously) and that the baby has been thrown out with the bathwater as far as the approach to our own history is concerned. I am 100% in favour of studying, at last, how it really felt for those on the other side of the fence, as it were - Bantu, Indian, Burmese, Maori or whoever - but not to ignore the whole picture from the British side. With this, has come the idea that all British history must therefore have been taught "inappropriately" in the past and should therefore be left alone.

Today, plenty of time is spent on both world wars (which were once never touched, so I suppose something has to give tomake room) and in the last year or so my sons have completed projects on the Western Front (including the obligatory Tyne Cot visit), the Home Front in the last war (primary school, including a visit to the IWM) and I must admit both schools were full of encouragment for these. My elder son is writing an essay on Journey's End at this very moment. But, other than the world wars, which are quite prominent in the curriculum these days, and the primary school Roman, Tudor and Victorian "projects", I still despair of the huge gap that will be left in the chronological framework from, say, 1066 to 1914 by the time they leave school. There were certainly gaps in my day but it seem like one big gap today!

I suppose new subjects (IT etc) have crowded out some of the history taught; "social" history has completely taken over from "political" history. Hence the big projects about how people lived, which are praisworthy in themselves, but surely we should still know, at the very least, about the importance of Gladstone's and Disraeli's tussles; the many wars of expansion against the French (let alone 1794-1815!); the Glorious Revolution; the Civil War & Interregnum; Qn Elizabeth's action-packed reign; the interminable intrigues of the Wars of the Roses; the 100 Years War and the Crusades, as well as a certain Norman duke? Not to mention an empire on which the sun never set? Perhaps there's simply too much? It must be so easy for the Yanks, Rich, although such a brief and recent period can only ever be regarded as current affairs over here!!! Laughing

When I was 8 to 9, my primary school teacher was a dangerously violent psychopath - how he didn't kill any of us I'll never know, as he left many a mark on head, face & backside and certainly drew blood - but once a week he calmly sat us down and told us a story, mostly from British history. This thread has now begun to remind me how many topics he covered in a simple way for us: Caractacus; Alfred & the cakes; the oath which the Normans extracted from Edward the Confessor; Harold & the arrow; the Princes in the Tower; Columbus' voyages; Drake & the Armada; Raleigh, tobacco & spuds; Clive of India's three suicide attempts; the Black Hole of Calcutta; Wolfe at Quebec & his dying words; the Boston Tea Party; Nelson & Trafalgar (those glinting medals & more dying words!) & Florence Nightingale.

Simple stuff for 8 & 9 year olds which wouldn't pass muster in many ways today, but why can't these stories or ones like them be taught today? To 8 and 9 year olds, I mean. Looking back, I now suspect a love of history was sparked in these simple stories - and it was also a brief respite from the cane, the yard ruler & the palm of his hand!!!

Have been too long again - and the Stade de France beckons!

Peter
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mail
AMB


Joined: 07 Oct 2005
Posts: 921
Reply with quote
Can I ask a question?

Why, if we were taught simple British history when we were children, why it is not so taught today? Our imperial past helped shape the World in which we live today. The children of Britian need to know this - and be proud of our past: it's help shape their future.

AMB
View user's profileSend private message
Peter Ewart


Joined: 31 Aug 2005
Posts: 1797
Location: Near Canterbury, Kent, England.
Reply with quote
Quite agree, Andrew. And with your comments, Graham.

And also with your remarks about the My Story series, Dawn, which is excellent. Well over a dozen of these have been read by my sons and I agree they are very well written and produced. There is now a very long list of available titles and they are perfect introductions to each topic (from medieval times to D-Day etc) through the eyes of a fictitious but plausible young person "involved." Just the sort of well researched material which would lead to further reading on a subject, as they have done in our household.

Peter
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mail
Rich
Guest

Reply with quote
Dawn..great to hear about the "trendiness" of historical fiction..I like that....one, it's great to get the kids to read and two, of couse it gives them that link to a past where we all come from and can learn...

Peter et al..you might be surprised by this but when I was growing up I managed to read a bunch of books by Trease and Sutcliffe who if I'm correct did alot of historical fiction. Boy they were good and gave a fine introduction to me of what the heck was going on in the village greens and castles of ye olde England, Wales and the border country of Scotland. That has a lot to do of my great interest in what happened beforwe 1776...Wink....
mike snook 2


Joined: 04 Jan 2006
Posts: 920
Reply with quote
What happened in 1776.... Question
View user's profileSend private message
Rich
Guest

Reply with quote
heh heh Mike me boy..just remember there was no revolution...such balderdash..it was only a RESTORATION!.............those rebs just wanted what you're forbears had...........why the rights of Englishmen!!... Cool..and now we can even play rugby but we won't go into that one... Wink ...
Little Big Horn & Isandlwana
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
All times are GMT  
Page 2 of 4  

  
  
 Reply to topic